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Message de monarch - Envoyé le 06 Mar 17:19 |
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Message de maltese falcom - Envoyé le 06 Mar 20:49 |
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Hi
You think so.
I think its a disgrace.As loyal BA customers I enjoyed the full fare airline service to popular Med destinations.
I think BA has sold its customers down the river,they had the chance to buy GB and declined.The only service they are keeping is the Malta one,albeit with a ridiculous schedule.
I would never Fly Easyjet and I think we are left with little choice other than Low Cost or Charter Flights this summer
Can't wait!
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Message de FLX - Envoyé le 07 Mar 14:51 |
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Gee, I don't know. May be the majority did paid full fare and it has been profitable.
Apparently, a profitable route is no longer reason enough to get BA interested in today's environment. Routes hv to offer OUTSTANDING return on investment for BA to get excited. In that sense, leisure routes, even when yield is high, will never be as attractive as premium biz traveller mkts for BA. Afterall, when we pay for our own vacation, we scrutinize every penny/cent we spent. When lawyers/bankers fly to meet their clients, they just pick the best biz class available and charge whatever ridiculous fare to the clients' bills....
I notice a clear trend where BA(Along with the other big guys) is increasingly focusing a lot more on biz mkts while moving away fm leisure mkts. Globally, the entire air travel mkt is basically polarizing to either top-end or discounters. Less and less airlines are interested in the middle segement(Predominantly the good old mainline Y-cabin service and fares). I'm just glad that we still hv LCCs around. Without them, an avg Joe going on an offshore tropical vacation may be stuck with either high airfare or taking the boat(Well, an oceanliner).
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Message de captain bill - Envoyé le 07 Mar 15:29 |
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I will not go into any of the many reasons why this has happened but would direct you back to the comments by FLX which are most accurate for someone who has no connection or input as far as I know into the decision by BA but what I would say is don't be afraid to use Easy as they are not all that bad and are light years ahead of Ryanair.
I like yourself Monarch prefer the front line carriers as this is the way I was raised in the industry but we have to acknowledge that the majority of people in the UK now only want to get to the Costas so they can spend their money on boozz and make a right fool of themselvs and don't care about on-board service.
I would always pay a premium for a little bit extra on a flight but the majority will not.
I do believe from my research that there is a market for a quality airline flying to the holiday destinations but will anyone take this up, I suspect not.
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Message de SJR - Envoyé le 08 Mar 1:35 |
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Message de maltese falcom - Envoyé le 08 Mar 10:22 |
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I am flying on GB on Tuesday,sadly it will be for the Last time and.I am now left with either going through Barcelona or Madrid if I want to use a scheduled service on the One World Alliance.
And doubling my journey time.And doubling the price.
How long before Eayjet gives up the services that GB have run.As I don't think the passenger yields will be as high on Easyjet routes.
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Message de SJR - Envoyé le 08 Mar 12:08 |
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Only time will tell on that one but with regards to Easyjet yields i tend to think that yields could be quite high at least from Manchester since low fare carriers seem to do well from here, however i would be interested to see if Easyjet expands here at Manchester with Liverpool just round the corner. There is certainly routes they can run to big destinations that passengers would use. For example Amsterdam is currently not run by a low fare carrier and Madrid isnt opened at all until June when Bmi Baby starts. As for London Gatwick i would still imagine yields on the easyjet flights would be fairly high but as i said time will tell.
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Message de FLX - Envoyé le 10 Mar 10:00 |
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maltese falcom:
I won't be surprised if Easyjet ended up with decent or even pretty good avg yields on those GB routes. Don't forget the LCC model is a completely diff animal than the traditional mainline carriers'(Except ownership, GB is essentially BA in all other aspects) and it's not simply about lower costs. It's about ultra-high leverage on fleet utilization(In terms of total # of daily flights in their networks, GB can't be compared with Easyjet at all), human capital and IT(e.g. while many GB pax may still rely on travel agents down the street+BA check-in agents in the terminal, 100% of Easyjet pax book online and the majority do self check-in).
SJR:
I suspect no LCC flies to AMS because that airport is:
1) focused on/better suited for full-service mainline carriers
2) costly for LCCs to operate into.
Under BAA, LGW can't be cheap for LCCs but it does make an effort to cater to LCC-style ops. Landing slots are also more accessible and easier to catch many Intercontinental connection traffic.
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Message de captain bill - Envoyé le 10 Mar 10:20 |
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Easyjet flies to AMA and CDG from a number of mainline airports and offer a reasonable service.
Re LGW
LCCs will always do well out of LGW due to high population in S. E. England and flights only lasting around two hours max.
Easy could be turned into a very good airline if the right management team were in place who 's thinking and vision was not tunneled down the LCC route and if I could get my hands on it some routes would go but it would become similar in operational standards as BMI.
Ryanair on the other hand is what it is and will never change.
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Message de FLX - Envoyé le 11 Mar 9:22 |
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Ryanair will change...for the worse.
It' won't be long before they start installing hard plastic surface seats, remove all overhead bins+carpeting, add more seats by reducing lavatories to 1 per aircraft, starting installing seats in the cargohold of the 738s, etc. in order to beef-up their bottomline even further - truly revolutionary stuff and air travel will never be the same again....
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Message de captain bill - Envoyé le 11 Mar 9:43 |
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What a vision of the future FLX but then again we are talking about Ryanair so anything is possible.
I do sense a move away from Ryan by the business community who do want a little more for their money than the nothing provided by Ryanair and so Easyjet will gain by this and more so if they just pay a little more attention to detail.
I am on my way to DUB for the next three days so it will be interesting to hear what my colleagues in the R.O.I. are saying about Ryanair.
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Message de FLX - Envoyé le 12 Mar 15:43 |
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If the biz community does move away fm Ryanair, they'll start targeting young kids traveling alone to take up the slack. We'll start seeing primary-schoolers taking $ out of their piggy banks to pay for 1GBP/EUR Ryan flights to enjoy their school holidays in the Alps. Must be excellent news for Ryanair......Now we're talking real mkt penetration and starting them early..... Also, no complains re inflight comfort since most probably hv no prior flying experience anyway(Flying fm the upper-bunk bed to the bedroom floor doesn't count) and those colourful pre-school style seats must be a big plus for them.
1 little problem, I'm not exactly clear on the EU/UK air travel rules on min age for unaccompanied minors....
Hv a great trip to DUB.
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Message de maltese falcom - Envoyé le 18 Mar 16:16 |
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In reply to monarch's question,They have already started to 'strip' the planes.I flew LGW-MLA-LGW last weekened and nearly all GB aircraft have been stripped of BA livery and are just plain white.
I have to say the crew I talked to had mixed feelings about changing to EZY.They were glad of the job security at last but were unsure if going to EZY was the right move.
I think that BA have been quite shrewd in there moves.As I have found out that BA's mainline operation will be starting up alot of the ex GB routes from LGW using 737- 300/400.
GB service was good over weekend despite them having to rearrange my business class seat on sunday nite as they 4 people in one seat.
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Message de FLX - Envoyé le 19 Mar 1:57 |
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Not surprising re mixed feeling fm the ex-GB crew about the change of mgmt hands. I'm unaware of cases in any industry worldwide where all employees feel confident and not nervous about their career when M&A occur @ their employers.
Correct me if I'm wrong but many of those GB routes originally belong to and was operated by BA mainline many many yrs ago anyway. In fact, many hv always been marketed under BA flight numbers operated by partner(i.e. operation outsourced to GB). I view this simply as an airline(e.g. BA) regaining direct op on their routes fm an independent contractor(e.g. GB) which frankly, is quite normal in this industry.
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Message de Werkur737 - Envoyé le 19 Mar 2:37 |
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I know it's not the basic of this thread, but about FR (Ryanair) is mentioned lots of times is so many topics in this forum, and seem to be hated by their own way of flying . Ryan parked some aircraft some time ago and others are in service with Brazilian carrier Varig today.
I never flown with Ryan or Aer Lingus (which probably has a better inboard service in all means), but why Ryan is so hated by European and British travelers, like you guys not appreciate either?
Some time ago i was spotting at LHR, early 2003 and 2004, and my flight to Heatrow (PHL-LHR-PHL) was by BA (My only British airline experience).
The 744 and 763 BA old livery pictures i taken, before Union Flag tail, has grain problem and were rejected in Airfleets, and LHR was the only UK airport i've been spotting ever, in reference for the other thread in this forum, but was a great time. Then i was starting with digital cams.
I almost always fly with Y class to spend more money in the place i go traveling, more days or weeks, so my business class experience was a few times only (US domestic flights).
About GB...there was a time in ending eighties and early nineties this airline was independent, was better skies for this one. I still have LGW and Birmingham books with many airplanes pictures, taken in 1987 to 1991 in those airports, where i can see the very old livery of GB, good times!  
AIRFLEETS.NET STAFF
PHOTO SCREENER
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Message de Werkur737 - Envoyé le 19 Mar 2:42 |
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Message de Werkur737 - Envoyé le 19 Mar 8:59 |
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Message de treasurehunt - Envoyé le 20 Mar 5:31 |
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I flew twice last week with GB and am sad to say this will be the last time , i think easyjet have no idea about the customers they will inherit by taking over this airline . You pay the extra money to get a good service and comfort . Some longer sectors up to 4 hours in their seats ... you must be joking . Looks like a long slog via MAD/BCN to get to the canaries now :-(
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Message de maltese falcom - Envoyé le 20 Mar 8:00 |
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I totally agree !
Easyjet customers want a totally different service to GB customers.and I think that many of GB's customers will use other scheduled airlines rather than going ' low cost '.
I am not looking forward to going via Madrid or Barcelona to get to the canaries.
Still we have the memories !
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Message de FLX - Envoyé le 20 Mar 10:21 |
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Points taken. However, beyond the existing beneficiaries of GB's superior services, we should not lose sight that EasyJet may hv now made the canaries within easy reach to many more tourists on smaller airfare budget. 4hrs of basic LCC service may be a joke for some but perfectly acceptable for others. If that's not true, holiday charters in seats with tiny pitch+width on medium-range 757s wouldn't be that popular @ LGW.
Apparently, there's enough of us that prefer spending more $ on the ground and less $ in the air.....Blame it on mkt forces @ work and drive change.
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Message de captain bill - Envoyé le 20 Mar 18:13 |
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Do we think that an airline flying from the UK to the Euro Holiday Hot Spots (Alicante, Barcelona,Palma, Jerez,Ibiza and down to The Cararies ect) charging a little more but giving you a pre booked seat, in flight meal and bar trolley service would be a success.
This is being looked at by someone but I never said that.
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Message de maltese falcom - Envoyé le 23 Mar 10:41 |
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The ' charters' are using 757's that in some cases are 25 years old and are begining to show there age.example my parents flew LGW-TFS-LGW in feb on Thomas Cook Airlines.
On the Inbound leg the pilot had to abort the take off as the air conditioning failed as they began the take off roll.
After an hours delay they decided with the help of an iberia engineer that is was perfectly safe to fly without it.
However everybody had to sit in the freezing cold with there coats on!
Not fun I would imagine.I know that it could happen to any plane but as an aircraft gets older it becomes prone to slight techincal mishaps.
They are popular because they are sold as a package holiday and are built in to the holiday cost.
If you break down the cost of an airfare comparison between low cost - charter- full service. in some cases its not much different.
Example I flew LGW-TFS in november Business Class with BA
2 adults @ £575-00 return for the two of us.
A charter airline,who is shall not name wanted £710-00 return for the two of us.
So there not always the cheapest around..
Captain Bill, I am sure it would be a success as there are still a lot of us out there who are not LCC or charter/cattle converts!
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Message de captain bill - Envoyé le 23 Mar 18:11 |
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I know your right Maltese falcon and like you I always prefer to go by a front line carrier but unfortunately they don't always fly to the sun spots of Europe. I am going to Cyprus in three weeks and I will be traveling by BA via LHR to LCA rather than go with Fly Globespan direct from GLA .
Regarding prices I have always found I can travel cheaper to main line cities by the main line airlines than I can with the so called LCCs. They are fine if you want to travel to some smaller airport 30,40,50 or 100 Klm from the main city BUT the transfer cost then makes it so very much more dearer than flying direct by the main line carrier so my advice to everyone is check with the real carriers before booking with the LCCs.
Who was the charter airline go on name and shame we all do it on the form for if it is fact then nothing further can be done to you.
We hate Ryanair they're the pits they're the pits. Or so the football chant goes.
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Message de maltese falcom - Envoyé le 24 Mar 18:26 |
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The airline was First Choice and Monarch wasn't far behind about £25 difference.
I have flown LHR - LCA before its a good route.BA normally use 767's on these routes.One time there was about 33 people on one of these ' big birds'. Very odd seeing that much empty space.
I agree with you with LCC as Ryanair fly to Brussels, well charleroi.which is nearly in a different country never mind city !
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Message de FLX - Envoyé le 26 Mar 7:42 |
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maltese falcom:
The specific things U like about BA(Or mainline carriers) are precisely why BA has been retreating/downsizing fm those vacation mkts:
1) If a charter can ask U for higher fare than BA on the same route @ similar service level, I highly doubt it's profitable for BA to sell that ticket to U @ that price consistently.
2) It may be odd or even enjoyable/fun for U(Hence ITS A GOOD ROUTE) to consistently fly on BA 763 flights with about 15% load factor. Do U honestly think that's sustainable biz even for mighty BA? A golden rule I hv learnt about routes with consistently tiny load factor is that the operator will soon switch to ever smaller jets(If available) or get out completely.
A big diff between charter(e.g. 1st Choice, FlyGlobeSpan) and schedule(e.g. BA, old GB, etc.) is charter can get in/out of a route tomorrow whereas schedule has to commit significant resources(e.g. aircraft, local staff, ground handling contracts, etc.) @ a destination for a fixed lenght of time. If it's yield fm fare is consistently low(e.g. Insufficient pax paying full-fare biz-class tickets) and/or load factor is poor, schedule full service is willing to take lost upto a point before it eventually end and charter/LCC moves in @ a diff cost/fare ratio.
Of course, if U're willing to fly the classic hub-and-spoke system to get to your destination instead of non-stop by LCC/charter, the major carriers will always be there to serve U. But then, we'll be comparing apples with oranges....
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Message de captain bill - Envoyé le 26 Mar 8:42 |
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The flight maltese falcom took LHR - LCA with 15% load is low and must be one of the lowest recorded as the average is 74% which is good for a 767 in BA spec due to the higher cost charged on the premium class cabin SO if BA has passengers who are happy to pay top dollar to fly with them to LCA and other destinations in Europe IS there therefore room in the market for an airline offering a premium service to the hot spots for holiday traffic.
Yes but is it only out of the London area and that is my concern as to why the project may never get off the ground.
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Message de FLX - Envoyé le 27 Mar 10:05 |
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About those popular charters out of LGW on 752s, yes, they may be sold as package and yes the total cost may sometimes work out to be similar if U book separately. What I've noticed in the past few yrs is that for many consumers, they're actually willing to pay a bit more AND enjoy LOWER inflight service level for package deals if that will save their time+hassles in search+book air and hotel separately.
People must be getting either(Or both) busier or lazier in time spent on organizing their holidays.....
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