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Accueil >> Forum >> Open skies and new routes! Forum Aviation civile
Open skies and new routes!
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Message de EI-DUB - Envoyé le 23 Mar 17:32 |
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As we all know, yesterday was a momentous day for aviation with the open skies agreement being FINALLY agreed.
EI announced formally, that they will commence routes to
San Fransisco (starting October)
Orlando (starting sometime during or shortly after winter)
Washington Dulles ( again starting sometime during or after the winter)
I have also heard BMI are intending to shift a lot of long haul operations to LHR.
What are your thoughts on the agreement, and what routes do you think we are likely to start seeing from the european carriers?? And which routes do you think should be established??
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Message de Skid Kid - Envoyé le 23 Mar 19:32 |
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BMD: LHR-JFK. From the New York area to LHR there are already 4 carriers, AIC, BAW, AAL, and VIR with 24 daily flights. I really don't think that more are needed but that's what I have a feeling they will go for.
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Message de SJR - Envoyé le 24 Mar 23:32 |
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Well don't forget at Gatwick Delta also run a New York flight and i suspect that Continental will also be interested in starting this service from either JFK or Newark if they do not already run it. Sad news in a way for Manchester it just seems like we are losing all are flights recently. BA Connect and My Travel have been merged into other companies. Rumours suggest that First Choice will do the same with TUI, Air Baltic and Norwegian are pulling out. Now that is a large amount of carriers considering BA Connect, My Travel and First Choice are some of the larger carriers at Manchester. Just to top that I dislike the liveries of the TCX and TUI and they will replace those of MYT and FCA which i by far prefer. Oh Well, maybe some good will come of this for Manchester as well
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Message de speedbird9468 - Envoyé le 24 Mar 1:14 |
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Message de Werkur737 - Envoyé le 24 Mar 2:45 |
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Message de dan - Envoyé le 24 Mar 11:06 |
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Message de SJR - Envoyé le 24 Mar 18:08 |
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As expected the airlines now want to pile into LHR and as far as i can see it the only way they will get slots is by buying them from another carrier or waiting for expansion of LHR. May lead to some of the airlines that have been there since i don't know when having to look else where as they can't afford it. That in some ways would be a shame. Any news on Delta and Northwest starting routes. It would be a tremendous shame if NWA started now that they have got rid of the DC10 but allas this change has just come too late
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Message de Werkur737 - Envoyé le 24 Mar 19:57 |
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I wolud like to see more international airlines here in PHL. Unfortunately, is boring to see almost only US airlines. If the Open Skies arrives in PHL would be better for spotting.
AIRFLEETS.NET STAFF
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Message de Spot planes - Envoyé le 24 Mar 21:00 |
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OT:
Werkur737, if I were you I shall move to LAX. The weather is a lot nicer than PHL and lot more different airlines to spot. You will not be bored with just US domestic airlines only. At LAX you can practically spot most international airlines from around the world. Best to spot smaller airlines from the south pacific, e.g. Air Pacific, Hawaiian,
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Message de captain bill - Envoyé le 24 Mar 21:07 |
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I have mixed feelings about this agreement. From an Industry side I do not like it just as I did and do not like budget airlines for what they have done to the industry. From a passenger point it will be good as it will drive the prices down and give more choice but for me as with the budget airlines I avoid them as much as I can and use the conventional proper airlines who know how to provide a service. The same will apply on the pond.
It is going to be dificult to get into LHR unless as SJR says they buy them from other airlines but who will want to give up slots at LHR.
I think we will see a number of new routes into LGW but this could be the last straw for some of our premier carriers as there could be a large number of airlines who have never crossed the pond want to start services on a low cost basis so STN and LTN may see a number of new trans Atlantic routes.
I also think that there will be services to many of the up country airports BHX MAN EMA NCL GLA EDI PIK to name a few.
I think the US airlines , most of whome don't like the agreement, will gain more from it so I do think we will see more activity from AA, Continental, Delta and NWA.
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Message de Skid Kid - Envoyé le 25 Mar 0:36 |
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Message de speedbird9468 - Envoyé le 25 Mar 2:26 |
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This idea that I had about open skies will and no doubt fill at least 99.9% of the slots at LHR and LGW. What we might see apart from the North and Midlands getting more traffic/routes we might see the likes of Continental/American/Delta etc operating smalller aircraft such as the great 757/737 BBJ/767 into places within 2 hours of London That have a good road and rail service to the Capital. I'm originally from Bournemouth (but now in live in the Northeast of Brazil) But seeing as Bournemouth has recently annouced a 32 million pound development programme to widen taxiways work on the small terminal etc it is very capable of handling 757/767 traffic. I even think it's maximum aircraft size with a full load is 747/200 and MD11. So if were lucky we may see some T7's or A330 traffic. I know they operated a 747-200 direct to New York some time ago. But Hey with this new Open Skies Anything is possble now
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Message de captain bill - Envoyé le 25 Mar 7:27 |
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There is also a thought among the European airlines that they might use some of their LHR slots to forward to JFK, ORD, LAX and so on. Airlines such as Air France, KLM and Lufthansa could fly a mid morning AMS or FRA or CDG to LHR and use their departure slot to cross the pond rather than return to origin. Then or return use an early morning slot for arrival from the USA and then return to AMS, FRA or CDG.
What the future holds for Trans Atlantic travel is up in the air and just might not be as good as many people think it will be.
I take your point Skid Kid about SWA but you need to try Ryanair here in Europe, yellow and black plastic interior with adverts plastered all over the overhead lockers, cabin and gate crew that can hardly speak English and just the general attitude of we don't give a #'*$£#~@ from all of the staff (which comes from the top down) makes it a diabolical airline.
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Message de EI-DUB - Envoyé le 25 Mar 11:36 |
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I agree with captain bill. You need to try Ryanair sometime. not a pleasant experience.
Captain bill you say you have mixed feelings about it. Surely its only a good thing that the agreement has been reached for airlines like BMI or Aer Lingus, who were hampered in their expansion plans by this. This agreement will allow increased competiton, and expansion for the above airlines for example.
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Message de captain bill - Envoyé le 25 Mar 15:10 |
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I am delighted for BMI and Aer Lingus and am sure that they will provide their usual high standard of service but what gives me concern is the long term damage that could be done to the industry by some airlines who come on the pond with the intention of only being there for a short term to make a quick buck.
I remember the open Sky policy of the 1960s and 70s when any airline could be chartered to do cheap Trans Atlantic work and yes as a boy my parents took me to Canada on some of these flights but it got to the stage where they didn't operate to a timetabe but to a calendar.
I know it will be much better regulated now but if fares come crashing down to the proportionate levels they were during the time I am talking about so will many of the airlines charging these low fares.
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Message de Werkur737 - Envoyé le 25 Mar 17:30 |
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Thanks for the tip Spot Planes! I'll think about LAX in near future. For sure it's a great airport and i'll never be bored again, with many airlines for spotting.
You know which airports i can see Aloha 737s besides Hawaii, or Aloha flies only in the Hawaii?
AIRFLEETS.NET STAFF
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Message de Skid Kid - Envoyé le 26 Mar 1:01 |
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Message de speedbird9468 - Envoyé le 27 Mar 11:12 |
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I tired ryanair sometime ago. BOh to DUB. Thank God it was just under an hour. I had my legs around my and even a cereal bar and a orange juice WOW! Flying out of BOH was great but Ryanair ??????? But this thread is not about that.
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Message de Skid Kid - Envoyé le 27 Mar 19:24 |
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I have not had the pleasure to try Ryanair yet, but it does sound pretty bad. Believe me, I know all about people not speaking English here in Mexifornia. A lot of the airline CS is very lacking, I am making a real effort to not fly DAL or NWA anymore.
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Message de Werkur737 - Envoyé le 28 Mar 22:21 |
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Message de aaa - Envoyé le 05 Jul 21:50 |
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UK Gets Tough On Open Skies Talks
British transport minister Ruth Kelly told the United States on Thursday that Europe would press for further liberalization of transatlantic air traffic.
The government with our European counterparts will be strongly pressing the case for further liberalization in Washington, Secretary of State for Transport Ruth Kelly told reporters.
It is neither in America's nor Europe's interests for the restrictions to continue, she said.
In March, EU transport ministers gave unanimous support to an open skies deal which will allow EU airlines to fly from any city in the 27-nation bloc to any city in the United States and vice versa, replacing restrictive bilateral arrangements that date back to World War Two.
EU states can withdraw benefits of the agreement from US airlines if Washington does not agree by 2010 to a second phase allowing foreign airlines to buy more voting rights in US carriers and permitting them to run domestic US services.
Looking to other markets, Kelly said: We will continue to press forward with liberalizing air transport markets, sweeping away outdated restrictions on routes, schedules and fares which still hold back development of our links with key economies, for example in Africa and Asia.
Kelly called for both industry and the public to increase vigilance and preparation in order to avoid airport chaos this summer amid recently tightened security.
Security measures have been ramped up after two men rammed a burning car into Glasgow airport on Saturday, a strike linked to two car bombs in London that police defused.
Kelly also said the government was planning a summit on transport security later this month
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